Gurps vs. D&D

jynexia · Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 6:49 pm Post subject: Gurps vs. D&D

Dan your wrong! D&D is way better than the Gurps system. Gurps I don't know well enough to really provide a strong critique, but from having played both, D&D is much easier for a Noob to catch on to and the system is less complex. If I hadn't played Vampire the Maskerade before I wouldn't understand the little about Gurps that I do. However, you guys are very good at simplifying the process so that it is really fun to play. Having never played D20 modern (and that is the D&D equivalent to the games I've played in Gurps) I cant honestly compare game mechanics but from what I know if it wasn't the simplified version you guys play it wouldn't be as much fun. Then again every DM is different and that could be a major factor in why I've heard very bad things about Gurps. Dee's system on the other hand...I like (I won't say more because I don't know how much I can say).
_________________
~jynx~
I need to go to my Happy place, but I accidentally blew it up, so now I have to find a new one... Sad

Dave · Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2007 10:38 pm Post subject:

I see no poll.

D&D, specifically 3.5, is actually a very good system, for what it's meant to reproduce. If I want to play a larger than life, sword and sourcery, few against impossible odds, video-game-like hero, then yes, give me D&D. D&D is also MUCH more newbie friendly. My complaint against D&D is the fact that TSR WHORES it out HARD. THAT soured me pretty good.

GURPS, on the other hand, is fairly hard to get at first, but once you know what you're doing it allows for characters and games that generally pass the test of believability, characters that can be modeled as ANY hero (or villain) you can imagine, and rules that can be as simple or complicated as you like. I'll play either, but GURPS is still my system of choice for the kinds of games I run.
_________________
"Addiction can neither be created nor destroyed, it can only be changed."
-Clango, Diesel Sweeties
===
I (heart) Hanners of Questionable Content.

Parsifal · Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2007 11:28 pm Post subject:

For me the System is a necessary evil of pen & paper gaming. That being said, in general I prefer GURPS to D&D. I do like to play me some 2nd Ed AD&D but thats just because the rules in general are silly and we feel like being retarded. I'm mostly okay with 3.5 but avoid Prestige Classes and most of the people who play them. Its like Counter-Strike (or more recently, Halo). The game itself isn't bad but it attracts a certain type of griefer/power-gaming 6 year old in droves.
_________________
<(@_@<), <(@_@)>, (>@_@)>, <(@_@)>, <(@_~)>, <(@_@)>, <(@_@<)

jynexia · Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 4:41 am Post subject:

Prestige Classes can be fun if everyone is playing on that level. Also you have to be familiar with the class and mercenary before they edited it was very broken. But I would have to agree with Dave. I just prefer D&D. I like/am used to the system. I miss my d20's....Joel can I use a d20? (specifically saying can I use a d20 where the split for lower or higher is at 10...I now your tricks.)
_________________
~jynx~
I need to go to my Happy place, but I accidentally blew it up, so now I have to find a new one... Sad

madcatmonkey · =^-^= Joined: 19 Nov 2007 Posts: 381

I never really got to play GURPS enough to know what it was like mechanics-wise. The rules seem like they might be cumbersome, especially since I'm a very rules-light type of player (like Parsifal said, the system is a necessary evil), but the creation system is great, I love the way it lends itself to really fleshing out a character's personality.

I played D&D a lot more, because more people knew the system, and it's a bit simpler, like Jyn and Dave said. It has a good flavor, but it seems to me to be more for hack & slash than nuanced roleplaying. But maybe that's just my experience from the groups I've been in, and there's actually a lot of potential for RPing with the right group.

So I guess I can't really choose between them or say one is 'better' than the other, I like both and would happily play both. (I'm equally bad at learning rules in either case. >_< Hehe.)

madcatmonkey · =^-^= Joined: 19 Nov 2007 Posts: 381

So for people who have had more experience playing both systems, how would you describe the difference in play in the various systems? Do you make more rolls in one than the other, for example? Does one seem to resolve things more smoothly/quickly? Do you tend to perform different types of tasks in one than in the other? I'm very curious. Very Happy

Dave · Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 8:25 pm Post subject:

CHARACTER CREATION
DnD:
Pro: Making a character is very straight-forward and easily picked up by newbies so play can start very quickly. Your characters will grow from simple bright-eyed youth to heroic adventurer taking on gods and demons with confidence... assuming he can stay alive after his first few encounters against small fluffy bunnies and such (old school DnD, a house cat could KILL a level 1 mage with ease...)

Con: characters are all tailored to play in medieval fantasy settings and not much else. The variety in characters can be limiting, as a Fighter would have a REALLY hard time boning up on Social skills, and a Mage has little hope of ever learning any physical skills.

GURPS:
Pro: Character creation is extremely flexible, allowing you to play practically any character in any setting. Go for that brain-in-a-jar in an 1800's victorian gas-lamp fantasy.

Con: The very flexibility that the character generation allows can be overwhelming to a newbie. It also lends itself to munchkinism to players who want to "play to win" as it where. Even experienced players can have a hard time making a character since there's always the opposing pulls of "concept vs effectiveness".

PLAY
DnD:
Pro: Since the rules are tailored to one specific genre, DnD does that genre exceptionally well. Encounters fly by, disputes are resolved quickly by a quick glance at the book, and everyone knows exactly what's going on if they've taken the time to read the books a bit.

Con: You're going to be a dude wielding a sword, or maybe a dude casting spells, and you're gonna be hunting down the 1337est of lootz... over and over again.

GURPS:
Pro: ("Because who wouldn't want to be able to play a Psychic Mutant Vampiric Space WereBunny fighting the legions of Cthulhy on Discworld?"). As crazy as that sounds, you COULD do that if you REALLY wanted to.

Con: Since the rules are attempting to cover a lot of ground and be as Generic and Universal as possible, play can slow down if there are rules lawyers in the group that are insistant. The players have to trust the GM to make judgement calls a lot, and the GM, unfortunately, needs to have some level of people skills to handle his group because even the best PC and GM groups will have arguments come up, and hunting down a rule for a situation can get very tiresome.

In the end, I like DnD when I just want to get into a game, have some fun, and not worry too much about things. I like GURPS when I have a specific idea in mind and I have the will (and stamina) to wrangle together my gaming group. GURPS tends to be a bit taxing on me as a GM, but I've had more than my fair share of really rewarding experiences because of it.
_________________
"Addiction can neither be created nor destroyed, it can only be changed."
-Clango, Diesel Sweeties
===
I (heart) Hanners of Questionable Content.

madcatmonkey · =^-^= Joined: 19 Nov 2007 Posts: 381

Cool, thanks for a good thorough explanation of the system differences. It sounds like GURPS would be a bit difficult for me to GM (and possibly to play, lol), but dang if I don't love that character creation system. *hugs her Compendium I*

I think I've put "play through a GURPS IOU Campaign" on my "List of Things To Do Before I Die." I will not give up even if it's the last thing I ever do! *determined*

jynexia · Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 3:50 am Post subject:

If you ever find yourself in LA and bored (especially on a sunday evening) hit up us here at squish. They have a killer ongoing game of IOU. I was only in it for one game but it rocked!
_________________
~jynx~
I need to go to my Happy place, but I accidentally blew it up, so now I have to find a new one... Sad

madcatmonkey · =^-^= Joined: 19 Nov 2007 Posts: 381

Man, I seriously wish I were down there and could hang out. Sad

I live in a small city with very little to do. Razz

Plus Squishy seems like it would be a lot of fun. Maybe I should try to become an intern. Wink

Celo · Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 7:42 am Post subject: Intern For Hire!

May I vouch for Madcatmonkey to be my intern?

Signed:
Regional Promotions Director/Public Relations/ Community Relations (Damage Control) Mistro

Celo

Mike · Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 10:55 pm Post subject:

D&D is something I can visualize being played by anybody. Like... I can picture in my brain... a retarded monkey... throwing a d20 against a wall... (the visual is making me laugh). But that Monkey is doing everything there is to do.

Yes, I'm close minded. D&D = Risk. Gurps = Axis and Allies Dee's system = Axis and Allies with the fucking extra rules he made... paratroopers? I hate you dee.
_________________

Karazorel · Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 11:53 pm Post subject:

Dave · Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:29 am Post subject:

That's a good question, and one best answered by Dan, since I believe he's the Squishy person with the most (read "any") experience with Whitewolf, with the possible exception of Arturo.
_________________
"Addiction can neither be created nor destroyed, it can only be changed."
-Clango, Diesel Sweeties
===
I (heart) Hanners of Questionable Content.

jynexia · Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 4:12 am Post subject:

Though not technically a member of the squishy crew, I believe I have the most whitewolf experience since I played for 5 years on and off. Whitewolf is a messed up system with crazy possessive writers. However very fun to play when you mix old and new. The newest whitewolf system, that completely throws out the past books, is fun in it's own right and way more adaptable for storytellers. However I still prefer the old system because the history and dark world (i.e. Vampire government) structure makes way more sense and therefore is a lot easier to play. Also the older system has more character choice except the Caitiff (or mixed breed) which better crafted in the newer system. Oh, and the discipline of each clan makes more sense in the newer version and story lines are more congruent, which mostly comes from experience and revision.
_________________
~jynx~
I need to go to my Happy place, but I accidentally blew it up, so now I have to find a new one... Sad